Culture
Kool & The Gang leader talks Ohio origin and Rock Hall induction as “Celebration” commemorates 250th
By: Ian Saint
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WASHINGTON, D.C. (WOUB) — PBS’ Capitol Fourth: 250th Weekend Celebration airs on WOUB-TV Friday at 8 p.m. ET. The star-studded program includes “Celebration” players Kool & The Gang, whose origin and history enshrinement trace to Ohio.
Group namesake and bassist Robert “Kool” Bell and his bandmate brother, key songwriter and saxophonist Ronald “Khalis” Bell (1951 – 2020), were born in Youngstown. In 2024, they were inducted to Cleveland’s Rock & Roll Hall of Fame.
Kool spoke with WOUB’s Ian Saint. A transcript of their conversation, edited for length and clarity, follows.
KOOL: Van Halen was a great tour. David Lee Roth really gave us lots of support. His uncle opened Cafe Wha? in New York, so he was a fan. He told me, “Kool, we played ‘Jungle Boogie’ and ‘Funky Stuff’ in LA. You have ‘Ladies Night,’ ‘Celebration’; we have ‘Jump.’ Let’s have a party.” And we did.
IAN SAINT: Any other iconic touring mates?
KOOL: Sly and the Family Stone, Elton John, Rod Stewart, Dire Straits. We did The Mike Douglas Show with Sammy Davis Jr. hosting. We toured with The Jacksons; and our promoter Dick Griffey said, “You guys are doing well, but you need a lead singer.” What are you talking about? We had several hits. Well, The Commodores had Lionel Richie; Earth, Wind & Fire had Philip and Maurice White… so maybe it’s time.
IAN SAINT: How did your Youngstown roots influence you?
KOOL: My grandmother played piano. My father Bobby Bell was a top featherweight boxer. When he went to New York, Miles Davis trained in the gym at the managing firm for him and my uncle Tommy Bell. Miles wanted to be a boxer. My father said, “Miles, I don’t want to spar with you — if I hit your lip, I might mess up your trumpet career.” Thelonious Monk went there as well. My father, Miles, and Thelonious used to go to Cuba before the sanctions; so that was an influence.
My mother’s sister saw how we were living in Youngstown – “Girl, I’ve gotta get you out of here.” She brought us to New York; we lived with her sisters there, then moved to Jersey City. Pharoah Sanders and McCoy Tyner in jazz would come through. One of our first band names was The Jazziacs. From there, we became the Soul Town Band — backing up acts doing songs by The Temptations, James Brown, etc. Then we became Kool & The Flames. Working on our first record, our manager said, “You can’t use that because James Brown’s with The Famous Flames.” I suggested Kool & The Gang. Our first album and single came out in 1969, all named “Kool & The Gang.”
IAN SAINT: Your “Jungle Boogie” bass line captivates me. In that busy part right before the first chorus, you’re playing the same quick progression as all those horns; but when the refrain starts, the horns are fretting all over and you’re doing your own thing — yet it all sounds cohesive.
KOOL: I was somewhat self-taught, and our guitarist Charles Smith showed me lots of different things. We learned different feels from backing those Jersey City singers covering Motown. For “Jungle Boogie,” the bassline followed the horns, I work with the drums — I’m not one of them fancy bass players, I stick to the group’s house foundation.
IAN SAINT: Madonna sampled “Jungle Boogie” for her Erotica album’s title track, and she included “Erotica” with your sample in her 2023-2024 retrospective Celebration Tour. Do you remember getting Madonna’s sample clearance request?
KOOL: I think (Like a Virgin producer) Nile Rodgers was involved with that. Nile and other producers, as they hear something, they say, “Oh, I like that lick in that part. Madonna, you know Kool & The Gang; check out this sample.” Janet Jackson also sampled “Jungle Boogie” (for “You Want This”). We’re one of the most sampled bands in history. It’s a good feeling. We knew nothing about sampling — all we knew wanting to play music.
IAN SAINT: “Celebration” was co-produced by Eumir Deodato from Rio de Janeiro, a very celebratory city. How did that collaboration emerge?
KOOL: When we decided to get a lead singer, Deodato was producing at the House of Music in Jersey. We knew what he did on jazz music out of Brazil, so we thought “Yeah, we’re going to be jazzy.” It didn’t go down that way. Deodato said, “Listen, I know you love jazz. But you have a lead singer now, so you’ve got to work around them.” So when you listen to (Kool & The Gang’s first single with JT Taylor) “Ladies’ Night” with the horns opening, that was it — Deodato had them open for the vocalist.
Deodato had a 20-piece orchestra playing on “Celebration.” My brother Robert Bell was all happy we got this big orchestra. When it came time to mix, Deodato took that out. My brother wasn’t happy — “Why’d you take out the orchestra?” Deodato said, “Because that’s not where the song’s at.” The song was with that Michael Jackson-sounding guitar. He said, “That’s the hit.” And he was right; it’s still one of the most played songs in the world. “Celebration” was played on the International Space Station, waking the astronauts. Weddings, “Celebration”; the hostages’ return from Iran, “Celebration”; 250 years of America, “Celebration”…
IAN SAINT: And celebrating your Northeast Ohio return for Rock Hall induction — alongside fellow Jerseyan, Dionne Warwick. I’m very sorry most of the band already passed by then. What would you like folks to know about them?
KOOL: All of them were special. George (“Funky” Brown) played drums, then switched to keyboards. He wrote “Ladies Night” along with the other band members. Charles — who’d shown me those little licks — was into Wes Montgomery, if you listen to his playing. Then you had Dee Tee (Dennis Thomas), he was also our stylist. Ricky Westfield, Spike Mickens — all of them were the make-up of Kool & The Gang, and they’re gone. I’m the last man standing. Then JT did 10 years with us; he played a special part in keeping us going.
I was born in Youngstown; I could’ve walked to the Hall of Fame. We came along all these groups in the Rock Hall. I said, “When are y’all gonna give us a little love?” It finally happened for the old Buckeye Ohio boy in New Jersey.
IAN SAINT: What conclusions would you like young people in your Kool Kids Foundation to draw from your remarkable Northeast Ohio full circle to Rock Hall induction?
KOOL: We used to play Sly’s song, “You Can Make It If You Try.” Learn as much as you can about the music business. Hang in there — we’ve seen hills, mountains, and valleys. Stay strong, believe in what you’re doing, and don’t give up.